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Post by ylevental on Nov 8, 2015 12:54:54 GMT
Neurodiversity is a very controversial topic. Wrongplanet once was openly a Neurodiversity forum, but now bills itself as a general resource forum.
Some proponents of neurodiversity say that famous people in Math, Science, and Technology like Einstein and Gates were on the Spectrum. They like to claim that they were introverted, but they also had good communication and social skills. Additionally, there is no evidence that they were in special education or needed special help. The two most known autistics in this field are Temple Grandin and John Robison. Grandin claims to be a typical engineer, but says that she failed algebra, which is very unusual. Robison never needed any special assistance, and was able to start a business, which requires good social skills.
They also say that even if this isn't true, very few people become famous engineers, and neurodiversity should just be accepted. However, for people that claim to be autistic but never needed special help, I don't think this makes sense because mental conditions are a very important matter, and people shouldn't lightly use those labels.
Some also say that some autistics that seem disabled secretly have special talents, but the reasoning is very thin. How do we know for instance that Down Syndrome or Fragile X is actually a gift in disguise, using that exact same reasoning?
Overall, what worries me the most is that on WrongPlanet, there were several people over the years that claimed to be suicidal because they couldn't find work with their degrees or didn't even have any degrees, but they were NOT given the option to find a cure by others as a solution, being told that they were too talented with no evidence. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2015 15:29:58 GMT
By the time I tried to edit after using a Quote of the OP, I forgot what I was going to say. Sorry about the preceding blank posting, I was not able to delete it.
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Post by btbnnyr on Nov 8, 2015 19:15:34 GMT
I am studying neuroscience in graduate school and hope to become neuroscientist.
I was classically autistic child who required special help to learn to communicate at late age and also help with very prominent ef problems in middle school.
Definitely autistic traits had big negative impact on my life during various periods, but I think I have learned to use/improve/adapt my brain better and better over time.
Socially, I am probably less intuitive than most autistic adults.
But I am good at science research, and some of the goodness I attribute to natural autistic traits, but most to my own efforts of working hard and going out of my comfort zone, which is probably even more important than working hard.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2015 19:42:21 GMT
Definitely autistic traits had big negative impact on my life during various periods, but I think I have learned to use/improve/adapt my brain better and better over time. Metacognition - thinking about thinking - is something you have probably used to tailor your mental workings to situations, capitalize on your strengths and compensate for your weaknesses. Good luck in your studies, I think it's wonderful that you can bring you personal perspective into that field. |
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Post by btbnnyr on Nov 8, 2015 20:00:34 GMT
Definitely autistic traits had big negative impact on my life during various periods, but I think I have learned to use/improve/adapt my brain better and better over time. Metacognition - thinking about thinking - is something you have probably used to tailor your mental workings to situations, capitalize on your strengths and compensate for your weaknesses. Good luck in your studies, I think it's wonderful that you can bring you personal perspective into that field. Yes, I think thinking about thinking is quite important. That was one of the skills I learned in therapy, which was quite effective for me. Some people for whom therapy is ineffective seem to believe that it is therapist's job to understand them, but ackshuly therapist's job is to teach them some thinking about thinking/feeling skills for them to understand themselves better and have greater control of their behaviors and lives in the direction they want to go instead of having no control or feeling like they have no control. |
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Post by ylevental on Nov 8, 2015 20:36:15 GMT
I am studying neuroscience in graduate school and hope to become neuroscientist. I was classically autistic child who required special help to learn to communicate at late age and also help with very prominent ef problems in middle school. Definitely autistic traits had big negative impact on my life during various periods, but I think I have learned to use/improve/adapt my brain better and better over time. Socially, I am probably less intuitive than most autistic adults. But I am good at science research, and some of the goodness I attribute to natural autistic traits, but most to my own efforts of working hard and going out of my comfort zone, which is probably even more important than working hard. Pretty interesting. I would like to know how your mind works.
I used to be really good at doing simple arithmetic really fast, until I found out there were no careers in that area. So I decided to become more well-rounded, and found out that potassium supplements helped me.
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Post by btbnnyr on Nov 8, 2015 20:48:42 GMT
I am studying neuroscience in graduate school and hope to become neuroscientist. I was classically autistic child who required special help to learn to communicate at late age and also help with very prominent ef problems in middle school. Definitely autistic traits had big negative impact on my life during various periods, but I think I have learned to use/improve/adapt my brain better and better over time. Socially, I am probably less intuitive than most autistic adults. But I am good at science research, and some of the goodness I attribute to natural autistic traits, but most to my own efforts of working hard and going out of my comfort zone, which is probably even more important than working hard. Pretty interesting. I would like to know how your mind works.
I used to be really good at doing simple arithmetic really fast, until I found out there were no careers in that area. So I decided to become more well-rounded, and found out that potassium supplements helped me.
I think my mind mostly works on bits and pieces, small concrete details, then I have to work harder to build those up into larger idea. I can't understand very well when others talk from top down, I almost never know what they are saying. For people who like numbers, things like accounting and some data science careers are good. My mother does accounting, and she is very good and fast at mental calculation. I quite suck at mental math, it is hard to add two-digit numbers in my mind. Computers do all my arithmetic for me. Sometimes, I use a calculator or google to add 5+9, I am often unsure if it is 14 or 16. Testing: is it possible to edit a post after an hour? Result: oh cool, it is. |
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Post by itt2 on Nov 8, 2015 21:58:25 GMT
Neurodiversity is an important concept for me and my kids. None of us isNT, but we don't fit neatly anywhere else, either. The concept that there are many neurological variants that are "acceptable" helps people like us have a place to fit.
I have never understood why people "accuse" neurodiversity of things like overreporting the prevalance of autistics in positions of prestige. People who believe in neurodiversity might do that, but neurodiversity itself just means, to me, that there is more than one "right" neurology. To me, it seems like people have taken a pretty simple philosophy and have attached dogmatic views to it.
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Post by btbnnyr on Nov 9, 2015 0:21:52 GMT
I think it is hard to separate the idea of neurodiversity and the behaviors of neurodiversity advocates.
I am not against the idea of neurodiversity, although some of its more eegstreme ideas don't make sense to me.
I am quite turned off by the behaviors of some advocates.
I have a big problem with promotion of facilitated communication by neurodiversity advocates.
I know that it could be very bad if FC worked for a person and they were really communicating and no one believed them, but the large preponderance of evidence shows that it does not work, and it is much more harmful in my opinion to believe it does in general than to believe it doesn't in case of specific individuals.
Now I have replaced egg with eeg, but I don't think it seems any smarter.
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Post by gollygee on Nov 9, 2015 2:04:19 GMT
I think the message of neurodiversity should be that society should be more accepting of "outside the box" thinking and behavior, so long as that behavior isn't doing anyone (including the person doing it) any harm.
For example, if a kid likes to flap his arms when he's happy, there's no harm in that. Accept it as neurodiversity.
If a kid can't be potty-trained, though, don't say something glib about neurodiversity.
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